Bruno Fernandes: Roy Keane Twisted My Words. They Offered Me £200M, I Said No.

In the football career, you go through a lot of ups and downs and a lot of difficult moments. And let's say the ones that suffered most of the family. They see your good moments, your bad moments, your good side, your bad side also. But they always start by you. Your time at Manchester United has been a bit of a roller coaster like this. And so on that day when you get a big offer to leave Manchester United for a contract that was worth a reportedly 200 million, why didn't you go? Manchester United's captain Bruno Fernandez has arguably become their greatest player in the post-Ferguson era. There is a single player in the Premier League who has more assists since his arrival. He's won more club player of the year awards than Ronaldo. And only five players have scored more than his 70 league goals. So I'm at the Manchester United training ground. To ask him the questions, the footballing world wants to know. Including, recently Ricky and Chris signed his dual mentality based on a quote he claimed you said. How do you respond to that? He came criticizing me, killing me, saying that I'm not good enough, that I'm not a good captain, that I'm not a good player for the club. It's okay, I don't mind. What I don't like was when people lie about things. I even ask Ollie, his number to have a word with him. Did you speak to him? Guys, I've got a favour to ask before this episode begins. The algorithm, if you follow a show, will deliver you the best episodes from that show very prominently in your feed. So when we have our best episodes on this show, the most shared episodes, the most rated episodes, I would love you to know. And the simple way for you to know that is to hit that follow button. But also, it's the simple, easy, free thing that you can do to help us make this show better. I would be hugely grateful if you could take a minute on the app you're listening to this one right now and hit that follow button. Thank you so, so, so much. Bruno, to understand somebody, I always think you have to start with where they started. And the early context that they grew up in, and we were just talking before we started recording about Porto. I'm on a journey to understand why you are the way that you are, because you're such an anomaly on the pitch. And you career when I track the journey of where you've come from and how you continually were promoted and pushed forward at a very young age. It's clear to me that your early context, your early upbringing, and whatever it was that was present at that age has shaped you in some very, very important way. What is the sort of earliest thing I need to understand about where you came from and that environment? For me, it's all about families, about taking care of other people. And I think to succeed, not just in sports, but in life, you need to be very careful of your surroundings. So I think the values of my family, the values of my parents, or what make me the person and the player I am today. The older I've gotten, I'm now 33, so I think I'm two years older than you. The more I've realized, actually with time, what I learned from my parents, and the values that my dad in particular gave me, he never... A lot of the things, it's not something he ever said to me, it's like modeling what he did. So seeing how he behaved, what's that for you? It's kind of the same. My father was never a person to show his emotions too much or tell you what to do or how to do it. You would just do it, and you would understand by his behavior, by the way the things that that was his way of showing us how he has to be doing. It was never a person of like a king kissing and stuff. It's got now into that. Even when I come out of games and stuff, you see like I always get his hug, I always get his kiss, and this is something that I as a kid. I knew how much he loved me, but in this small aspect, it was always my mom giving this kind of love. He was more in the way of he was showing how things have to be done, how much you have to sacrifice yourself to certain things. My dad was very strong with me in terms of like games. Imagine I could come out of a game scoring two, three goals or whatsoever, and my parents, my dad in this case, will always pick up the bad moments ahead in games to make you understand. That wasn't that wasn't that was good, but was a great is always margin to improvements. You know, it's all small things. And I think I've learned such from such a young age to deal with criticism that I'm now in probably one of the biggest clubs in terms of like carrying criticism and attention. That doesn't hurt me like I don't like it. Obviously no one likes to get criticized, but it doesn't hurt me. It doesn't change the way I behave. It doesn't change the way I want to do things. But from the other side, it makes me understand there's still things to improve. And I listened to that and I look at my game and I see if he's needed of changing of improvement in my game. And my dad was always very strong in that with me. And I see nowadays the parents, you know, my dad never wanted me to be a footballer. He wanted me to become a better person, a better player or a better student. Everything I wanted to do, he just wanted to me to do it at like 100%. You want to do this, you have to do the best you can. You can't just be happy with the you go to a test and let's say in Portugal was from zero to 100%. And you have 98 and you'll be the most obvious person. No, you can be happy because that result is amazing. But you left 2% then that you still can improve. So you always always showing me that even if it was just a small thing or a small detail, you still have something more to do. You still have something more that you can improve has become better. And that's something that stuck with me, not just in football, but in life. I don't like to do things 50%, 67 or 80. Whenever I'm included in something, I want to go full, I want to learn as much as I can. I want to be the best version I can in that aspect, whatever it is. I mean, it's really interesting because I wonder to myself how I think you start playing football at five years old. Yeah, five. And were you good from five years old? Were you different from your peers at a young age? In such a young age, I never think about being a footballer. I just wanted to play football for life. I'm just happy playing football. I just want to have this ball in my feet every time, all time. And you joined FC Investor? Yeah, that was my first club. At five years old, I mean, I've got some photos of yours as a young man here. I've got so many photos here, but you must be roughly around that age then. And remarkably, I've read that after one training session, they moved you into the older group and you played with people two years older than you when you were four or five years old? Yeah, I was five playing with the seven years old. Why did they move you into a different group? I went for the first session and it was a football session, five a side, but like an indoor thing. And after the first session, they told me that now you need to get on the grass. And then I think it comes just, you know, I looked at the other players and that other people that were training with me. And I didn't want to be better than them. I just wanted to like getting at them was the same with getting at my brother. There was five years old for me. For me, it was no difference. If I have to beat him up, I will beat him up. You know, like one V1, I'm going to go past him. I have to tackle. I'm going to tackle him. He's going to tackle me stronger. I tackle him again. And I was, I had no fear. And I think that was the thing that made me become better and better because I was never the best. Like technical ability. Yes, I was good. Was the best. No speed was I quick. Yeah, I was quite the quick was the quickest. No, I was the strongest. No, I was the tallest. No, but I had no fear of anything of that. I had to sprint with someone that was quicker than me. I'm going to speed with him. And I'm going to, I might not beat him, but I'm going to get close to that. I actually read that you were so aggressive that referee sometimes asked your coach at investor Sergio to sub you off. Otherwise, they'd have to send you off. I mean, that kind of correlates with what you were saying there about fear. Yeah, you were aggressive. I was like, that's what I mean. Like I had no fear. You know, like I wouldn't look at faces or sizes whatsoever and think like, oh, it's bigger than me. You know, like it's going to, it's going to be stronger than me or so. I'll get into any, any ball in any moment in the, in the game with, with no fear at all. And this is probably the best times in my career between investor and Boa Vista. Because this one is investor. This one is that Boa Vista, when I've just, I stayed probably a year at investor and Boa Vista got me straight away. And you moved quickly up and up and up and up. And that was one of the remarkable things I noticed when I looked at you starting playing at five years old, getting promoted to an older team. And then quickly, almost in all the clubs, you know, I'm looking at when you were 17 years old and you left Portugal and moved to Italy to join Navarro. Yeah. And after three months there, you were promoted to the first team. And then you very quickly joined Yudanezi. Yes. And at Yudanezi, you met a guy called Francesco, a compromising surname, but good Lini. Good Lini, yeah. He was really, really formative in your career. Wasn't he, you were 18 years old? 18 years old, yeah. Why was he such an important part of your career? What did he teach you or give you at Yudanezi? He was the manager that probably gave me the basis and the foundation to be fearless and express myself, you know, like to get my head out of so many things that were going on. And as a young kid, that has just made the step into the Serie A. And he's like, oh, I need to, now is the moment I need to show myself. But he was like, you don't, you showed me that you have the qualities when you were in second division in Italy. That's why we brought you. And to be honest, I was on the edge of coming to Oxford on loan. What food? Yeah, because it's the same owners. And we were getting at the edge of the transfer window. They just bought me and obviously they had a big squad with a lot of players and they were like, we're going to send you to Oxford, you're going to, you're going to be there playing for them. And I was like, what have I done? Like I wasn't, I wasn't good enough. And then in the same moment, they called me to go to the hotel, pack my stuff. Because it was like last days this, pack my stuff, I was with my girlfriend, wife now. And she was like, don't worry, we're going to go anywhere else and you're going to succeed. And I said, but why can't I make it here? Like, what was that I did wrong that managed it like not looking at me the same that is looking to other players. And in my head was like, have I done something wrong? I've not like showed my full potential. I've not shown that I'm good enough to be in this team. And I don't know why in the middle of all this thought, the sporting record called me again and says, Bruno, you can't go anymore. The manager wants you to stay. He says, you loved you. He loves your attitude. You want you to learn from him. You want you to understand how he wants to play and everything. He says, you might not play much this season, but he's pretty sure that you are the type of player that will succeed at this club. And then we had many conversations. And I think when you want the manager for young players that very quick will play and will think like, oh, I'm the guy now is going to make you understand. Stay calm. I got you, but you're still not there. And he was so good for me. He was like a father future, you know, like, but not just for me. If you speak with every player that was there at that time, they knew they were important for him because he always showed that. And that's why we made me so much more complete in terms of understanding the moments and the process that managers have to go through their heads. And what they think about players that is better or whatsoever that you don't understand whenever a manager puts on the bench, just think doesn't like me is doing this because he makes he wants to make another one play. But the way he did it with me and all the players that were around me at that time, we were so happy that the environment was very, very good. As a young man, when you're this age or 18 years old, what are your dreams? And if I'd asked you at the time, what is your future look like? What would you have said to me? As soon as I became a professional player, I was like, I want to be on the top clubs. I want to play for the big clubs. I want to be in the Champions League. I want to play for trophies. I want to become the players I'm looking at. I want to become like them. Did you think you could? Always. I've never, never dealt. And at 22, you get a call and you return to Portugal and sign a five-year deal with sporting in a deal worth reportedly 8.5 million. That next season you scored 20 goals and added 13 assists, which was unheard of for a player in your position. And what I read as well is that Tottenham were interested in you at that time. And it was, it was at one point highly likely that you were going to end up moving to Tottenham. I'm very glad you didn't as a man United fan. But tell me about that. So Tottenham could call you. Yeah. I spoke with Tottenham and we were very close to get an agreement done. Then in the last two days or one day of market, the sporting just said we're not going to sell him. We're going to keep him because we need him. And you wanted to go to Tottenham. Yes, because I wanted to play in the Premier League. Because for me, it's the best league in the world. It's the most competitive one. It's the one that I think when you grow up, you dream to play for, you know, like full stadiums, top clubs, top players. Obviously, I was lucky enough that my dream club to play in England was when United and obviously Tottenham at the time was the option ahead. I was very, very happy to join them because they showed me the process that they were going through. The manager there was there at the time. They also really wanted me. All the new things, the new facilities and everything. So I was very happy with everything that I could see going forward. But it didn't happen. And for bigger reasons, I guess. And then in January, I got the call that I was hoping for for two, three years already. Tell me about that call because I know Manchester United has been, you know, in your eye for a long time. I mean, I know you grew up watching people like Cristiano Ronaldo play for this club. And I think when he, I think when he first played for Portugal, you were a young guy. He was like eight or ten years old or something. And he had been a great star of Manchester United. But I think generally people of our age group, we grew up in the heyday of Manchester United, the Starbucks Ferguson era as well. So why Manchester United? And can you zoom me in? If I'm a fly on the wall when you get that phone call from your agent, I guess, that Manchester United, I can see the smile on your face. I was, let's say I was in my wardrobe, I was getting, getting ready to go to bed. We just had to, my wife was just putting kids, my daughter, that time I only had my daughter to bed. And I get the call from my agent. I knew things were going on and everything. But after what happened with Tottenham, I didn't want to put my focus on transfer windows. And I never did it in every step of my career that I've changed club. I always said to my agent, whenever he's like 95% that the club really wants me and he's ready to make an offer, tell me and then I decide if he's like the right moment, then I want to go. A part of that is I'm like just keep him apart. Keep me apart. I don't want to know it. I don't want to like to lose the focus of what I'm doing to something that I can't control. And after the Tottenham thing, I was like even more because obviously I was basically done. And then all of a sudden, last day, the sporting just says like guys, they text Tottenham and say like we're not going to make it. So he called me and he said Bruno, so you told me to not speak to you until we had something like concrete, concrete. But just so you know, they also have agreement already everything. So it's just on your side now to say yes or no. And I was like, yes or no to what? And he said, come on, you've seen the news. I said, my agent calls me gas and the news are every day different. Every day they're going to put the new club days interested in me. So I'm not I'm not going to be focused on that. He said, okay, many nights is coming for you. I know, I know this is like why you want. So just so you know, this is this is the one that you've been waiting for. So is on you now to make a decision. And for like 10, 20 seconds, I didn't I didn't say anything. I was I was crying, but I didn't want to talk because you know, like your voice starts going a little bit. Chucky and then all of a sudden, my my wife gets into the world where she says, I'm still on the call. And she goes like, why are you crying? And like, even on the phone say, are you crying? I was like, I turned that off. And I was like, because it's called me. And then in the moment, I'm trying to explain to my wife what's going on. And it's calling me like repetitively like, I need an answer. And I was like, and my wife was like, why are you crying? So like, this is like what do you have a dream for? Like, this is the moment you've been waiting for. And I was like, I don't know. It's actually just too much. Like, I've never expected after everything that happened with Tottenham. I would have got the chance to come to the Premier League again. And having the chance to come to the Premier League with many United is it's like 100% of the dream complete. So obviously then, like, I just, I just call it back. And I said, like, I don't even want to know anything else. Just tell them I'm going, obviously, I was very good at sporting. And I was very happy there because I really enjoyed my time at sporting because was when I became probably the best version of myself as a player, where I improved so much in that two years and a half. But then was like the dream of playing for the Premier League. And I think from every sporting fund, they really understood that was ready for me to go and do the next step. And when you join, I mean, here's the famous photo of you signing with Manchester United. Yeah. It's funny, the smile that you still have in your face when you look at this picture. Yeah, it's because I think when you look back, as I said, this is the day your dream comes true. So it's probably professional wise. I think I put this one and sporting together because of the importance that sporting at the micro year. But obviously this was the cherry on top of the cake because this is where I wanted to be. And you joined the club at a time when the club was in a bit of a turmoil struggling. You know, Sarah Alex Ferguson has left. We've cycled through a bunch of managers and we've got Oligona Soshara as the manager at that point. I think the club was seventh in the Premier League when you joined. And it was going through a time of turbulence. You knew that Manchester United wasn't the most stable club in the world. But you chose to come here anyway. And based on your record sporting, you have had a lot of other opportunities to join a club that was more stable. That was, you know, and it's interesting because clubs can have a big impact on a player's future. Players can have a big impact on the club, but it also goes the other way. And as someone that runs businesses, you know, the environment you join has a huge impact on everyone's behaviour. No irrespective of how hard you try. You chose to join a club that was at the time unstable. But look, the game I looked before I came here was, I think, Burnley, United Burnley, and United loses a home to one. I don't remember exactly, but I know I know they've lost that game and it was just like days before I came. And I was like, I still think there is there's a lot of potential in that team. And a part of having potential in that team, I'm drawing one of the biggest clubs in the world. And I know that clubs go through periods where things don't go the way they want. But sometimes it's not just because they're not great, it's just because other teams are being better than them. And that's fine because in football you're not going to win all the time. But the thing you can do is like you can bring your own values, your own experience, your own qualities, and trying to help everyone else around you to become better, to become the team you want to see. And I think at that time, that period of, that we had the COVID time and all the stuff, but that period from there to the end of the season, the team was unbelievable. And the season after we got second place, and because we struggled in certain moments of keeping up to the standard of city, that had a very good end of season. But for me, I wasn't like how I'll fix that. I was like, I'm going to be the magic powder that's going to solve all the problems. But I really knew that this club had something special. And for me to join it was, was like, I can be part of something that is going to become great again. And I still believe that. And obviously, you can take time. It's taking more time than I thought. Yes, of course. But at that time, I had too many dreams in my head and they still are here. And still a lot of things that I want to achieve. But this smile and this guy that came here in 2020 is still the same guy that wants to win and succeed at this club. I'm wondering, because it's been so much said about the environment at Manchester United over the years, I know a little bit about the environment when Sir Alex Ferguson was here, because I interviewed a lot of his players and having been to Carrington before and actually going to the grounds, and actually sitting in the hospitality lounge and waitresses coming over to me, and talking about when Sir Alex Ferguson was here, and how he knew everyone's name. And then how it changed. It was really interesting to me to get a lot of this feedback because it highlighted how small things in culture can have a big impact right down to the way players play. And there's always a story that Gary Neville told me about with Wendy and her charity balls. He told me a story of the players walking past Wendy who got the charity balls signed for a local charity. And one day, a couple of them didn't sign it. And Sir Alex Ferguson came downstairs and he, quote, fucking killed us. And it's a strange thing to do, like, to care that much about a small detailing culture. But over time, Gary told me he understands why Sir Alex Ferguson cared so much. So my question to you is really about the cultural evolution of this club. And what the fans are desperate to know about, like, how it's changed and how it feels different from the time you arrived in 2018 up until today. I've brought in my behaviour, the way I've been raised and all these things. I think every different player has brought different things to the club. But I think one of the things that has to be always there is the respect for people. And I think that says, for me, is a non-negotiable thing. Like, if any player comes to this club and he doesn't respect the physios, the stewards, the people that are in all the desk we have here, the people that work for us in the restaurant, the chefs, and all these people that are around us, taking care of us, even if you don't see it, or if you don't think it, or whatever it is, for me, is a non-negotiable thing that the respect has to be always there. And more than respect the care, you need to care about them. Because if you have a good foundation, a good base of respect and care in your club, it's going to get better. The environment gets better. Everything is more positive. Because I think, and this is probably the way I've been raised, I treat everyone in the same way. I don't treat the players in a way that I don't treat the clean lady or the people there in the front desk or the people that the stewards and the entrance. If I say, good morning to these ones, I say, good morning to these ones. I don't change that. If I give an unchecked to these ones, I give an unchecked to this one. If I greet them as, I'm greeting my teammates, they will feel part of it. They will feel involved. They will feel as important as them. Even knowing that the role of time is completely different of the other ones, because the role of a CEO is one thing. But if the cleaner doesn't clean everything nice and leaves everything prepared and well done and everything, you will notice that something is wrong. You will notice that this is not the place where you want to work for. You notice that you don't want to be the CEO of a company that has trash everywhere. And so why wouldn't you greet the person that takes care of you, takes care of your place to look so good and to make an impact when people come in from the outside? It reminds me of something, actually, Johnny Ives. So Johnny Ives is the famous Apple designer that designed all the Apple products that we know and love. And he said, it's very hard to feel care. He goes, but everyone can feel when someone didn't care. You go to a restaurant and they didn't care. Small things. He goes, it's like, he said, care is just this thing in the background. This ambient feeling you have when you arrive somewhere. But you can't like point out exactly what it is, but you can feel it. That's the thing. I think it's more that you feel it, but you don't see it. And I think touching this point I was, I was talking about cleaners. My mom was a, she was cleaning houses for work. So I never wanted the people that were cleaning house to treat my mom badly or let's say, don't grade the work she's doing for them. Because for example, now I have a person that works in my house. I don't allow my kids to talk badly to her. I don't allow my kids to say, grab that, you put it in place. And I said a tour in the first day she came to work and I said, if something is not in the right place, obviously I want you to clean. I want you to put things in place. I want all of this. But I don't want my kids to tell you that arrange that or put this in place. No. If they want something, they can ask you. But first of all, they need to be respectful. If they can't make it, they have to ask you. But in the respect way. But if it's something that they can make, you have to make them make it. Not like, oh, you do it. No, just explain them how to do it. Show them the way. So they learn with it. And this probably the way I behave with the people that work with me, it comes a lot because of my background. Of not like it to see my mom. Because I was not in the houses, obviously. I don't know if they treated well or not. My mom never said to me that any of the people that she worked for were but to her or treat her in a bad way. So I really think that that made me understand that because I don't want that for my mom, I won't make that to other people. I've been a man United fans since I was a kid. So my siblings were born in Manchester. I was saying to you before I was born in Botswana or in Africa. But because I've got told brothers who are a man United fans, I very quickly became a Manchester United fan. I remember like three, four years old. And then as soon as I could when I was 18, I moved up from the Southwest to Manchester. I was 18 years old and I lived here. And went to my first Manchester United games. I've seen the club going this incredible journey from Sir Alex Ferguson's era to this sort of period of transition to where we are now. And it's my observation, my honest observation, that after in the post-Furkey era, the club made some bad decisions as it relates to recruitment and culture. People often talk about Edward Woods. I'm not going to I'm not going to translate you up in any way. I'll get you to talk about anything particular. I'm expressing my opinion. They talk about Edward Woods' strategy towards signing players and it being a bit flippant. And then you look at the sort of group of lads that we had. And just as a United fan watching on the pitch, I felt the culture was a bit confused because it didn't seem like it seems now where it seems like there's this really strong central agreement around the values. It felt a bit, I don't know, a bit like we had signed players because they were famous or big, but not because they fit. And I feel when I look at the club now, I go, oh, these guys kind of fit. And whoever's doing recruiting is thinking about character. It feels to me like there's been this process over the last couple of years of getting rid of the wrong character profiles. And I think how Amerin really spoke to this. He really talked about getting rid of the players that didn't have the right character profile. Just to add one more line to this, I've spoken to a lot of players at the club in past and present. And they expressed the same to me as well, that there was an issue with sort of character profile that has now been solved for. I think the main mistake that the club has done through the years and that we've changed manager to manager, they were very different. And that's already a bad sign, not of recruitment because then you bring in players that fit that manager. But the next one you brought plays a completely different way. And the three or four or five that you bought don't fit this one anymore. And then you have to buy another four or five. And then the constantly change of strategy in the club or in the way we wanted to play whatsoever was not the best because then obviously it becomes that the players don't suit anymore the system is not even more the character than it comes up is more the system. Then obviously we can talk about character that players that were certain players that were not a perfect fit for the club. You never know it until you bring it to the club. I think sometimes you can see it. And I think it's their players that I think the club by the behavior they have on the pitch or the behavior they have on social media whatsoever, you can see if they will be a fit for the club or not. And I think the main thing for the club, as you said there, you need to bring good characters because that will be more important to build something that good qualities. Because good qualities they all, they will have. You don't bring a player to many nights that does have qualities. But if you cannot have the qualities to the character, that's a win-win. Because the qualities will be moments that the quality won't be as good as you want because players go through periods that sometimes they play very good, sometimes they play very bad, but the character remains the same. And that's the character you want where they are on a low to be the right character to push himself to be on a high or at the same time when they are on the low, to be the right character to push the other ones to be at the top level. And I think that's the main thing that the club has to do in terms of recruitment and everything is bringing people, first of all, that want to be a man United to play for a man United. Not to be a man United just because it's a big club. They want to be here because this is the club they think and they really understand that they want to succeed with this club. They want to bring this club back to the days we were used to see a man United. I know it's been 12 or 13 years. I know, but we want that to get as short as possible to become that club that won 20 Premier League titles and is joined the most in the Premier League. So, character in the football club is more important than the quality. Because the quality you're always going to get it and you can improve it. This is what I heard from Pitchie Severer. I remember him telling me that he met Sir Alex Ferguson in an airport, I think in France. And Sir Alex Ferguson sat him down and said, are you willing to die for Manchester United? And he said, yes, and so he shook his hand. He said, welcome to Manchester United. And that's a different way of recruiting. He's not testing if he can kick a ball well. He's testing if he's got the heart and that mentality that I think Fergie and previous sort of cohorts in Manchester I'd really, really cared about. I think Sir Alex, obviously he's done mistakes in recruitment too because obviously not every player was great. But he always brings players in any time and any moment they would fit the club. And that's the main thing I think in terms of recruitment this is like something that is not for me to get involved. But I will say it. I understand the club has different managers that comes in, comes in in different ways of playing and whatsoever. But the recruitment has to be for many United because the player will get normally a five-year contract and the manager will get two. And you know that if he's not something he's not working the club always gets rid of the manager first then he gets rid of the player because it's much more difficult. So I think you always have to bring players that fit the club and then you bring managers that fit the club and the players you've got. And I think that says to be the thing that, for example, let's talk about club and pet, why they were so successful because they chose the players in together with the club that will fit the club, the system, and the way they wanted to play. And through the years I've had that mistakes, of course, have they bought players that didn't work. Yes, I think we're more the ones that worked and the ones that didn't. I haven't seen many of them coming out and talking about the club or about the manager whatsoever. Yeah, it's difficult to be there and a club by you for 50, 60, 70 million and then you don't play when you thought, oh, I'm going to play because being this month of five for me, I'm going to play. Then you get there, you don't play. Of course, it's difficult. But what I've seen is that they built in a way that the squad was strong enough to take care of those players that were not playing and were struggling. One of the things I've noticed as a change, especially the season, is all this social media distraction, people posting on their Instagram stories when they don't play their brothers sister posting. My brother should be playing whatever. All of this sort of social media stuff that some players were doing over the last couple of years seems to have vanished. And this is just an interesting, you know, we talk about small things, being interesting signals. It's one of the things I've noticed this year. There isn't social media nonsense going on. Like, I guess my question is, is that something the club has done? Has there been, have they sat you down and said, stop the social media stuff? Or is it just a consequence of getting the right people together? I think it's literally both. But at the same time, I think the club has to be the one being strong with the players. When they see something that is not right or they don't like it or it's not good on the players, on the team, on the attention this club gets, I think the club needs to talk with them. And with the agents, with the families, whatsoever, that speaks out and says something because I think it's also on the players to make the families and everyone that is behind them understand that what they put out or what they say can have consequences on our careers. Do you talk to the players about this? If I see something that I don't like or if I see them posting or replying to some people on social whatsoever, because for example, from such a young age, I've said to my parents, I've said to my brother, I've said to my sister, I don't want you talking without me knowing it. Not because they don't know how to talk forever, but they're not aware what can be part or wrong. They might think they will say something that is going to be good for me, but maybe has repercussions on other people and I don't want them to do that. So my parents never spoke, my brother never spoke, my sister never spoke when I wasn't playing. Let people make noise, let people talk. It doesn't matter what they say. I know from my mom, for example, she suffers a lot with this and I say, take it in. Don't care. Pray it your sense like you do to me all the time and make sure they do the right thing for me because that's what matters. And she comes kind of like it's okay with that. Obviously, I know that probably when my brother says something or my sister, they want to reply to something, they want to say it's not true. Why are you talking about this or my brother or whatever? I don't want them to get involved in that because not going to be good for them, not going to be good for me and it's not going to be good for my environment. I don't want that. But I think that is because I was strong with my family in the first moment and I think that's how to have to be. I don't go home to my family and saying like, oh, you know, this manager, this manager thought. I might say what I like or I don't like or whatever, but I don't go in a way of like, if I had someone that could put something out because I've been doing this. I don't care like to people to put out or brutally straining so well. Bruno is doing this. Bruno is doing that. I know I'm doing it. That's enough for me. And it's true because, you know, you've been through this process of transition with Oli, then Carrick, then Raff, then Eric, then Ruben, then Fletcher, then Carrick again. And actually one of the remarkable things is I've never noticed your attitude towards the managers be any different. I can't tell. As far as I'm aware, you support them all. And that's how it should be, I think. If you've got a problem, I think as, you know, play, you should go tell them, but we shouldn't know. And we don't know. With you, I don't know what you think of them. I agree with that. Because first of all, I like every manager that comes in my way because I learn with them. And every manager that comes in has their own idea as their own thinking, as their own way of playing, and they want me to do one thing, the other one, another thing, the other one, another thing. And for me, that's good. Because they believe that I'm capable of doing different things that I was doing before. So what I won't give to the managers is the choice or the option in their head to think I'm not going to play Bruno. What do you do when you're not happy about something, though? As the captain, do you go have a chat with them? No, I do whatever they want me to do. If they think is the best thing for the team, I'm going to do it. Either I agree or not, believe it or not, I make myself available for what they want to do, 100%. If then it works or not, that's on them to decide that. If it needs to be changed or not, I'm not going to go to the manager and ask them to change formation the way they play. If they ask me, I give my opinion. If they don't ask me, I don't say anything. What if you learned about what a good manager does and how to be a good manager from the six managers you've had? For me, look, through my career, I've always heard that certain players should be treated in a different way than other players. I don't believe in that. Is that the same as having a business? You buy certain people to do certain things because you believe they're the right person to do that. So I don't think that you then should change the way you behave with them. You should probably approach them in different ways. I believe in that because I'm not the same as you. So do you treat players differently on the pitch? Because you shout out lots of your teammates. Are there some that you won't shout out as much? I treat all of them the same. And I think they're kind of getting to know exactly why I do it. Everything that we trained in the... Imagine, let's see. During the week we trained this. And we have seen images of this. I know what you have to do. The managers prepare for us for that. I demand that. At least. I don't care who you are. We've been a full week preparing the training, the game for this. This we need to know how to do it. Then if you can make a pass or you can make a goal or you can make a tackle, that's different. That's the qualities I need from each one individually. But I've learned to talk with them in different ways. But with the same end result. Not like I won't like go to one and say like being scared of saying things to him. And the other one like, because he's younger whatsoever, I'm going to shout at him. If I have to shout at this one, I'll shout at this one. If I have to shout at this one, I'll shout at this one. If I have to praise this one, I'll praise this one in the same way I praise this one. And I think that you can see in my interviews, I'm not afraid of saying what I feel. At the same time, I'm not afraid of praising players for what they've done or what they're doing. Even if they probably in the moment, they haven't done as much as they needed to get the praise. But for me, I think he needs that praise to get into the next level. So I'm going to give him something, but I make him aware. I've gave you something. But I'm expecting something more from you. It's like my dad giving me like, you need to be better, you need to do more. Because he knows I'm capable of more. And this is why I demand from the players. I demand I'm very strong on them because I really believe in them. I have said this so many times, so many different players. It's like, trust me, the day I stop talking to you, the day I start shouting, I stop shouting at you, is because I don't believe in you anymore. And I don't believe you can improve anymore. Your time at Manchester, it's been a bit of a roller coaster like this, kind of like up and down and up and down. You went second, and then you dropped down the league. And I mean, the last two years have been a prime example of that, finishing neither the bottom end of the table and then this year back up to the third. I'm wondering, as a fan, when things get bad, and you hear all these sort of rumors breaking online that the manager's going to be sacked, does that impact the dressing room? Like, do you guys in the dressing room? Because you've been through it so many times where a manager has been removed. How, what's that like when you know things are going bad? Well, first of all, you feel it for the manager. Really? Is the first thing because I think obviously certain players will feel it more than others, because it's their players that play more than others. And they obviously, the ones that probably don't play, they don't like to see managers going, but at the same time, if a new manager comes in, there's a new opportunity for them to probably get into the team more times they were getting before. And I think going through the process of changing one is probably the worst thing in sports because it's starting from zero again. And if the people believe it or not, when you're through a process, you want to get to the end of the process and understanding what that has gave to you as a player and what you can do more with that stuff, with that team and with that manager to go even furthermore. Why didn't you lose hope because you went through that process of starting from zero, making progress manager goes back to zero, making progress manager goes back to zero. You know why? Because every time I've spoke this with Diego before, every time we come for pre-season is like a new start. And you always get that belief of like, this is going to be the time. This is going to be the time. It is moments through the season that you get this belief, the things are not going well. But the main thing I have is belief in myself. So I always think, if I do things right and I take people to do things right and I help them to do things right as a team, we still have a chance of pushing ourselves into positions we want to be. And this, let's say, this season has been that case because we struggled. Obviously, we didn't change manager because of results because we were two points behind second place. And like, five points behind first place, we were, same points till, I think from third to seventh place was everyone with the same point, something like that. So we were there. Was something different with the club that they felt that the trust between them was broke or whatsoever and they kind of decided to start a new process. And that was bad because for us, when Ruben came, what was passed from the club is like, this is going to be a process. But we're going to go through this. It's going to be good the same bad times. But we're going to go through this. Obviously, then the club decided that it was time to part ways and he started from zero from, from with Michael. But then, you've got results and you went to the end of the season and you finished third. And you finished what doing probably in the time Michael was here till the end of the season, till now is, we probably the team that has made more points. What did Michael change? I think in the first moment, what Michael tried to do is like to give stability to the team because as everyone understands when you come in after a break, you understand that you need to give stability and peace of mind to the players to get back to the level you thought we could have. And he brought the foundation and the base that has been in this club from the time he played till the time he managed and then he left. So he knows the club. He knows how the club wants to play and he knows what the fans want to see. How is he different? Like, what's tactically or from a character perspective? What does Michael bring as a manager? As just an hour ago, it was announced that he's going to be the manager going forward, which is great news. But what is, if you had to describe him to me as a leader and a manager, how is he different? I think he's a very, he gives you a lot of kindness, you know, in terms of why he wants from the team the way he demands the way he coaches. He gives you a good way of going to the game with a good peace of mind. But with a lot of responsibility because I think, from the time he was here with Saralax, he gave a lot of responsibility to the players to make decisions and to make choices on the pitch that have to be on you. He gives you the base, he gives you the foundation, he gives you certain rules that he's like the non-negotiable ones. But then he also knows and he wants us to take some responsibility through the game that things might change. Because you prepare a game full week, obviously. But then the team could come and do a different thing. Like, you prepare to play against the 4-3-3 because they always play 4-3-3 and then they come and they play 3-5-2. And then you go like, oh, and now, the manager can't be on the sideline telling you where to press, where to go. So, as a player, have the foundation, have the base, have the rules non-negotiable and from there on, we need to find a way of like, okay, let's imagine we come press because they've changed everything and the press we prepare was not the one we needed. Let's get compact. Let's get together. They don't get into our block. When we have the ball, we play with the ball. We get into the half-time and then the manager will give us the message he wants to give or whatever he has seen, that we need to do differently in a way of getting a better result from the pressure. And I think that's what he gave to us, the calmness and the way he prepares games was very good. But when things were not going in the way we wanted, he gave the responsibility to the players to make it work, then we solve it. Ah, so like a bit of freedom. It's not exactly freedom because freedom is a different thing. It gives you freedom with the ball to make decisions because it says, that's your responsibility on the ball. I can't tell you where to pass the ball. I can't tell you where to shoot. I can help you where the space is going to be. And I think that the most important thing for a player is knowing where space is going to be. You need to know where spaces are to then play with it. You know that they have big ups there that we can hurt them from there. And this is the message that Michael has passed to the team. It's like, if we talk from here, they have less people on this side. We can bring more people in the box from this side. We want a very good counter press because they have two strikers. So we need to have three people in the back. Two of them mark. One of them stays behind. So this is the small things and the foundation that it gives to us. But then it says many times. I can't tell you where to pass. I can't tell you where to shoot. I give you the solutions. But might not be there. So you have to find a way of making the good pass, the good shot, the good decision. Because I'm not going to be in your head in that moment. In your head, it's going to be the ideas I gave you. And some of them will be good. Some of them won't work out. So you have to make a way of like, understand the good ones I gave you. And the other ones that are not working well, you need to find a way of making it work. So it's more just he gives you the principles instead of specific instructions on how to play and what to do. It kind of gives you, but then it lets you balance through the game. Okay. Let's let's say you let's the players read the game because in 90 minutes, many things happen. And not going to always happen where you see in the video. Hopefully, yes, but not always. For example, let's say we had the chance against Nottingham Forest, that I passed the ball through Brian and his course. We have seen the same chance from Villa against Forest. The exact same chance, exact same movements, exact same passes. And we've seen that. We visualized that. And that's why that works. Because we had the ideas. We knew we could make that happen. And we made it. To see get angry. Because he seems like such a calm guy. When you see him in press conferences, he's very calm and very, you know. Yeah, he did, he did caught hungry one, one sort twice. But he's very calm in the way he speaks. But I think, I think everyone gets hungry anyway. But he's a very calm presence. And he's someone that speaks very well, knows the timing, the words, he knows what to say. And whenever he got, let's say, let's say more aggressive within us was the time that we needed to get that from him. And the way that you play is interesting. Because when I was looking at a bunch of your quotes over time, but also how I think about business, you are a player that takes more risks than most people. And we talk a lot about failure in business and how you have to increase your rate of failure to get better outcomes. But your play that is not shy of taking a risk. And you play in a way where you sometimes lose the ball. But you also, as we've seen this year in many other years, you often are generating more opportunities than any other player on the pitch. How do you think about this? Because the way you play means that sometimes you're going to make a lot of mistakes. You're going to lose the ball. More so than other players. I'd argue even more so than some of the previous midfielders we've had, like Carrick, who would often choose a more safe option than trying to play it through a thin gap. What's your attitude towards risk? I think it's always risk reward. You need to understand on what reward you're going to get from that. And if taking that risk is good for the team or not. Let's say the position I play, you need that. It's as to be one of your main skills to take risks, to do things that the game demands from you and to make sure that your teammates in the front get the ball in the positions that is going to be the rate of success for them to score a goal is going to be higher. I might miss two or three times, but if I get one right, that can become a goal for us. I think there's nothing better than a risk reward that is a goal. So I think when you play as a number 10 position, obviously you don't want to lose the ball. You have to make that as less as possible. But in certain positions, you lose the ball more often than others. Wingers will lose the ball the ball on one view once. Then midfielders do. Fullbacks will do normally more crosses than centerbacks will do. Number six is will make more tackles than a striker will do. So is a balance in the team that you need to have. Let's imagine I played with Coby and Cassad. They're not a risk player. So if I take four times, let's say, a risky pass and they take one each, that's six times again. So I need to be the one that takes four. They need to be the ones that take one one each. Because the responsibility that I have in the team is the one that they make the team play from the buildup, push the team forward to then get the ball into the players that have to take the risks. Because if you don't have the players that take the risks, you're going to end up bubbling. And we talk like, for example, let's say, Man City, there is a team that's that, I'd say Guardiola Tigitaka, all these things. The Bruin was the player that take the risks. Cherke is now the player that take the risks. Phil Fulton, Doc who, Maris, will be the ones that take the risks on a one view one. Has the manager ever told you to take less risks? Eric told me to take less shots from the outside of the box. He showed me a board with my success rating of shots on target, shots of target and goals. Show me the positions where I was more effective. And he told me, I think you need to get more into these positions to then make a shot into what positions. Let's say close to the box. Like in the position, we will see the box. And you would say like more towards the left hand side, you score more goals. More towards the right hand side, you aim more the goal. Towards the middle of the edge of the box, you miss more shots. So he was like, get more into the left side, don't get more into the right side, or close range, long range. So, but then obviously we come back to the risk and reward. Because sometimes obviously you're going to score a great goal from 25 yards out. But how many times you're going to do it? Out of five, you maybe score one. And he's a lot already. So I need to make that risk become less and less and less. Getting more risk probably from 18 yards. Because there's a possibility of miss scoring a goal. He might be three in five. Because I'm much more closer. I can put more power in the ball. I can be much more effective. I've spent the last decade building and investing in companies. And so often the conversation around marketing budgets follows the exact same pattern. The budget gets approved. But then the results don't come back. And most of the time, the creative pitch and the offer is fine. The problem lies with the audience. Ads reach people who will never buy or rougher. Nor do they have the power to sign off anything at all. And this is why so much budget gets wasted. LinkedIn ads, response of this podcast, lets you reach them specifically by job title, seniority, company size, industry, the skills that they have and much more. You're no longer hoping your ad reaches the right person. Instead, you're defining exactly who sees it. And LinkedIn ads drives the highest B2B return on ad spend across all major ad networks. Give them a try at LinkedIn.com slash diary. 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It's great for your gums, for stimulating gum circulation and for sawness. And the best part is it's not an extra thing to add to your routine. It just replaces your current toothbrush. If you give it a try, you'll get 20% off at BonCharge.com slash D.O.A.C. And also you'll get free shipping at a one year warranty at boncharge.com slash D.O.A.C. You've had lots of managers, so they've all asked you have different to be, you know, playing different positions. But on this pitch here, where is it that you like to play the most? I think the positions where I can be more effective is this square. Here. I would say that's, let's put it like this. Not just, just me the square. Oh, it's the square. This is, let's say, imagine we are talking this style. This is the spaces where I think I can be more effective in this square. And different managers asked you to play in different positions within here? Yes. Because for example, let's say, let's put here. With Ruben, he used to play three at the back. One wing back, two midfielders, another one back. Two tens. With Ruben, I played a lot of times here in this position when he first came. And in this position, these two, more than often, you wanted me to be one of these two to help here. To help these two midfielders to build up. And to get this high higher, the position when you can be in the last line, and to get the ball into this tube. So what position would you call that? This was the left, then, let's say. But he wanted me to play more like as a left midfielder, to help them to like, first of all, to have more stability in the middle. Second, to get the ball going forward. To take the risk of passing the ball forward. Then I played a lot of times here. What we're going to do is we're going to make you, unfortunately, we're going to make you blow just so we can see which one you are. So in this one, when I played here many times, he wanted me here because they were pressing, let's say, three against three. And he wanted me to come and do the overload. So we have one more player to build up. So they will open up these ones, a little bit more. Get this one more offensive. Normally, it was Luke Shaw. And as a full buck, he was used to play in this space. Luke could drive the ball and they could impress with the three they had. They would be able to press because we always had this one also to bounce the ball. Then whenever we go up the pitch with the ball, you wanted me here. Reving it. Yeah. You want me to play more, a little bit more higher to be one of the three tens and make this line of three tens. Then, for example, with the ole, I was playing, we would play like four, two, three, one. And it would be the number ten. And he wanted me to do this. I take it across. And sometimes you wanted me to do this. And get the ball here or here to make the long passes and to make the switches to the wingers. I think this bit here in the middle is where I'm more against, I think we all can see the best version of Bruno. If you ask me where I prefer to play, anywhere on the pitch. I think, for the way we play, this is the position I can be more effective, but I think I really enjoy to play here because I really enjoy to get the team to play. And if you, I played many times with the ten out like this, I was the number six playing with two eighths. I really enjoy it to play here. And he make myself a different player, more aggressive off the ball, someone that has to cover spaces for these ones. Regardless of where you are on the pitch, which can change, what is non-negotiable in terms of how you play? Commitment. That's non-negotiable. Like the commitment I have for what we have to do. It doesn't change by me liking the position or not, me preferring one position or the other. That won't change. I think running, fighting, and team spirit can never miss. It doesn't appear to me that you ever get tired. And also one remarkable thing about you is you don't seem to ever get injured. I get tired. But how does that happen? Because I want you to be the 89th minute and you're running up and down still. Is that genetic or is that something you do in training? What is that? I think, obviously, I have to say that I have good genetics. But I was talking video about this the other day, also in the nutritionist about genetics. How you treat yourself and everything. But then at the same time, I said to them, you know what's different on me than the other ones? Because I always train and under percent. I make the training as a game. I don't care. I go full. I don't feel good. I need to make some extra. If I feel that the training wasn't enough, let's do something else. Let's do some shots. Let's do some crosses to someone. Let's do something that can make me go out of training and feeling like I'm tired. What is that important? Because I think in the game you need to get tired. And then, you know, like, for example, when I'm training shooting practice or last third passes, I rather train that when I'm tired. Maybe the last 20 minutes of the game, your brain is not going to work in the same way it was working in the beginning because you get tired and you get to think slower a little bit. So you need to be able to train your body and your brain when they are tired. And I think if you do that in training, when you get to the game and you start getting tired, your brain is used to that also. Your body is used to be tired and it knows how to react into that moment. And I think it's important to be able to do that in training. It's important to be able to do that in training. It's important to be able to do that in training. It's important to be able to do that in training. It's important to be able to do that in training. It's important to be able to do that in training. It's important to be able to do that in training. It's important to be able to do that in training. It's important to be able to do that in training. It's important to be able to do that in training. It's important to be able to do that in training. It's important to be able to do that in training. No, obviously for me was a strange time because I was not expecting, you know, a tenor called me to his office to speak with me and to ask me if I wanted to be the captain of the club because he had decided to change the captain and he wanted me to be the one to lead the team from now on. Obviously, first thought was like very grateful. I'm like something that I've never dreamed about. You know, like you can have many dreams, but you don't dream about being the captain, you know, like a few club. And I think the second thought was like, this is going to be tough on Ari. And the first person that I spoke with after I got out of that was Ari. Because in you already, I think the manager spoke to him. And before I said yes, I went to speak with him because the manager basically made me the question if I wanted also like, he didn't say it like, you're going to be the captain, that's it point. He asked me. And I went to speak with Ari and the first question I made was if he was leaving the club. Because obviously, as you said, it's not something normal. I've never been through this in my whole career. And I spoke with him about that offer that they gave it to me and to be honest to him. And he said, he said like, if there's someone that deserves that is you and I'm very, very happy that is, is you getting the captain on one that, if I have to take care of for myself, I think you really deserve that. And I think that was the point that made me understand I was doing things right. Obviously, I know for him was very difficult. And I don't think he would have said something but even if he felt it to me. But the way we spoke and the way I think I've been treating him through these years also in the same way of like I said straight away to him like, you might have lost that armman, but he's still one of our leaders and that won't change everything that we've been through because are you when he was a captain? We always make decisions together also because I was one of them. And that hasn't changed now because every time I have to do or take some decisions for the team, I speak with certain players and Harry is one of them that is always there. And your performance this season speaks for itself. You've won, you've done 34 appearances, which I think is an achievement in and of itself because a lot of players aren't that consistent on the pitch. You've scored eight goals, 20 assists. You've got 12 player of the match awards, which is the most by any player in the Premier League, six player of the month awards, and only Sergio Aguera, Harry Kane, and Mohamed Sala have more, all of them have seven. And you've also won Matt Busby's Player of the Year Award for the fifth time, the most by any other man United player. And that's an award voted by the fans. And there's other awards that I know you've won in recent times. I saw you on stage the other day winning more awards. What has, what's happened? Why, why, why you sudden, you know, you've had, you've been consistent throughout the whole time since you've been at the club, but this year seems to stand out for some reason. No, I think, I think for this season, first of all, I think when the team shines, the individual comes up. And I think this season is being much better from the last, let's say, two seasons. At the same time, I think the assists record in all this going around made me having a lot of headlines and stuff like that. Obviously, it's an achievement that hasn't been done for any players, just Kevin De Bruyne and Terry. I've got the little graph here. It says, yeah, Kevin De Bruyne, Terry. I actually spoke to Terry about this as well. And he sends his regards to you. Congratulations, you're joining him up there with the record. Yeah, it's something that I'm very grateful for. I put my name in this case with them. Up there is something that I've never dreamed about or think about. I'd probably start thinking about that when I got probably into 16, 17 assists. I was like, oh, I'm actually getting closer now. But it was not something that was in my head, because in my head is always improving my last season and getting better numbers, better outputs, better performance. And it was never in my mind that I would go to 18, 19, 20, or whatsoever. But obviously, when you start getting closer, you start thinking about a little bit. And then all of us as fans start watching the games to see if you can do it. And then obviously, I think I've been very consistent in terms of performance during my six years year. But probably other years were people that stand out that more than me. And that's why I probably didn't got as much attention as I did this season. With being captain and with being at the biggest club in the world, I think in terms of fan base, with that comes pressure and responsibility. The world talks about you. No matter what industry you're in, an occupational hazard of being at the very, very top or the peak of your powers or being even better is more and more talk. And I think especially because of this, people are talking even more about Bruno Fernandez than I've ever seen. In my group chat, I've got my united group chat and we're watching the game. We're watching, we're willing you to, we were willing you to reach this record which you did. And now because you're, you know, people are saying you're the player of the year in the Premier League, they're giving you all these big awards, with that comes even more criticism. And I think this is where your childhood has prepared you. But your dad sounds like your dad prepared you. I wanted to clear something up because it was on my mind. And I imagine it's frustrating for you, which is when your words are twisted in the media and recently Roy Kean criticized your mentality based on a quote he got completely backwards. He claimed you said, I should have shot, but I made the passes and used that to suggest that you were chasing individual assist stats. But everyone who actually listened to the interview, including myself, knows you said almost the exact opposite. You were being self-critical of yourself in saying you should have passed the ball instead of shot because you wanted the best for your team. And so interestingly, because I've spoken to so many of your, your players, your, you know, your teammates over the last couple of days about you, they also told me that this is the exact opposite of your mentality on the pitch and off the pitch. And I know it must be frustrating for your leadership style to be sort of misrepresented in that way. How, how, how do you respond to that? Like, how would you deal with that when you hear it? And you go, that's not what I said. Yeah, to be honest, like I've always said, I don't mind criticism. I've always take criticism from everyone and anyone and I never replied to anything or whatever. People have an opinion. They think it's good part, whatever. What I don't like was when people lie about things. And this case that you said about working basically what you said is a lie, because you can either, either you saw some other interview or you can't say that I said one thing that I have just not said. And luckily for me is everything going to record. Imagine if it wasn't like then people will think like, oh yeah, Bruno is, is the guy always trying to go to the assist. But one thing that is consistent is my number of creation is always the same. So it's not that I've been trying to reach this now. No, I've been creating chances since I came to the Premier League probably more than anyone else. So it hasn't changed that. My type of player, aim of play or way of playing hasn't changed since I came to the Premier League. It's not that this season probably Roy Keen saw someone like Bruno creating more because he wanted the assist record. No, he's seen the same Bruno that is about risky reward, is about creating chances for his teammates, is about getting the best out of the other ones. Because the thing is like, you will get criticized anyway. If you say, if you were scoring goals, you will get criticized because you're not passing the ball in your shooting. If you're doing assists, it's because you're passing too much and you're not shooting to score goals. So it's going to always be like that. People will always make the balance the way they want. They won't balance thing. They will put it the way they want the things to be. And obviously I think I've always showed a lot of respect for Roy Keen and for everything he's done for the club and for everything he's always said. I've never ever had something to say. I've never said something wrong. I even ask Ole, is number to text him, to be honest, to have a word with him, to say that I don't mind the criticism. I don't like when people lie about things that I say. Because this is like, it goes a little bit over the top of the things that I think are acceptable. I accept the criticism. My accept that he can say things that I don't like and I don't like to see it. But as I said before, that improves me. What I don't like is that people make their own words on what I say. And it's not true. He can't criticize me killing me, say that I'm not good enough, that I'm not a good captain for him, that I'm not a good player for the club whatsoever. But it's okay, I don't mind. Is it an opinion? I like it. No, obviously I prefer Roy Keen to give me some praise sometimes because I've achieved something that not many players have achieved. I understand that this club is about winning trophies. I've never taken that out of my mind. I've always said in front of everyone that I want to in the Premier League and in Champions League. I never said I wanted to be the best player in the Premier League. Never, never one time. Any player in the person has heard that Bruno wanted to get his sister record or get the goals record or get the player of the season or get being better than anyone else. Now, Bruno wants the club to be successful. Bruno wants the club to win trophies and it's all Bruno wants. I accept his criticism, I accept that if my likes like me as a player or not likes me as a person or not but what I don't like is that he puts words in my mouth that has not been said. That's the only thing I don't like. Well, I did actually ask your teammates what you were like and I asked them on and off camera, on and off the record. I couldn't get some of them to be very serious but what I received is lots and lots of voice notes from lots and lots of your former players. I texted around last night and I'll play you what they said. My friend Bruno, taking this opportunity to spread some love to you. I just wanted to take this opportunity to tell you how much we value. You as a player and as a person, I think not many people get to see how are you after the games and outside of the pitch. I would say that's one of your best qualities, the way you care, the way you, one of the first to help everyone, leadership, your consistency. That's something that I take from example and you know it. It's been a lot of years together right now so hopefully this can continue and we can win so many things and so much more things together. Skip that. Tom, for me you're a world class footballer, consistently world class as well which is very difficult. I think everyone knows that how good you are but I think more importantly from my view is how you are as a human being and that's a side that not many people get to see. You know they care in, compassionate, supporting, demanding at the right times. But yeah I think for me that is by far in a way probably your best quality. That's why the leader of this team and such a good human being. So for me proud to call you the captain but more importantly a friend so top cost. I mean what he does on the pitch obviously speaks for itself but I mean away from football he's an unbelievable human being. The way he treats people looks after people, the way he lifts others when they need it. And I feel like the respect he gives everyone around him that says everything about his character. And I feel like I've been lucky to spend the number of years with him. And he's one of them people that you kind of appreciate having around you every single day. He's the type of player who makes people around him better without even trying. We love you Capitano. We love you Capitano. I mean I had so many more but we just don't have the time. Yeah now it's just you know the standout from that for me is just the way to speak. From me as a person not more as a player you know like. And you picked some people that I'm very demanding on them you know like. The open look as being a role to play has been more time with me. Tom is probably up there with Harry are you look you're going then Tom. And these is people that I really respect a lot. But as I said to you like he's not what they say above me as a player is more what they say from me as a person. That makes me very proud and very happy because. You can be a good player and I'm going to meet a lot of good players in the world of football. And you can train with a lot of them and meet them a lot. But I think that what it stays at the end is like the way you behave as a person. And I like to see that I have the good values that my parents showed me. That's what I said at the start when you started describing what your parents had instilled in you back in Porto. It sounded like what all your colleagues and your the players you play with said to me as well because I've done this before. And people will say oh he's a great player he's amazing whatever but what was consistently true through all of those messages. And that's really more is they all chose to speak about you as a human. And that's clearly comes from whatever your parents did at a young age. Why does that mean so much to you I can see it in your face. No because as I said to you I think as a player you can be as good as you want. Like at the end of the day I think the way you behave and the way you treat people around you is the most important thing. You spend so much time with them that they kind of become part of your day by day. You see more often than I see my parents. For example I obviously my wife and my kid is the people that I see the most but then after that is them. I don't see my friends from Portugal as often as them my parents my brother my sister I see more them. And the way I behave the way I've been raised the way I want to live my life and the way I want my kids to be is the way they've said the things about me and this makes me very proud. What is that emotion? I don't know it's just like it's good to hear that just just that. It's so interesting because I don't think anybody else that I've met would respond how you're responding to hearing people talk about you as a man and as a human. I don't know. I'm just a soft guy. There's a look on the page but I'm quite a soft guy. One thing I've learned from interviewing a lot of founders and building companies myself is that trust is the real currency of business. It's the thing that gets customers to buy partners to say yes and investors to back you but as you grow trust stops being just a feeling and becomes something you have to prove. Because the bigger you get the more exposed you are customer data security expectations regulations all of it and the risk of one small mistake becomes incredibly significant. And if you've ever tried to scale while keeping on top of all of that you'll know it can become a full time job but our sponsor Vanta automates your compliance processes and brings compliance risk and customer trust together through their AI powered platform and the company is already using Vanta say they spend 82% less time on audits because of Vanta's platform. Your organization wants to inject time back into building and growing make sure you head over to Vanta dot com slash diary that's Vanta dot com slash diary. I've done almost 700 interviews with some of the most interesting people in the world and one of the things you learn which is unexpected is that vulnerability is the doorway to connection and after sitting here for two three hours with a guest. I feel a deep sense of connection to them and as they leave what I get them to do is to write a question in the diary of a CEO we've taken all of the questions from the director CEO we have put the question here on this card with the name of the person that wrote it so you can sit at home as I do with my fiance and my colleagues at work and other people in my life. Whenever we get a minute we play at the director of a CEO conversation cards and it is incredible what happens these are great if you're in a romantic relationship and you want to connect your partner more these are also great if you're in a team and you want to bond your team together and I have to say they're also great for families that want to learn more about each other. And that need a good excuse to spend some time in a digital world in the analog environment connecting human to human it is remarkable what the right question at the right time can do go to the diary dot com and you can get these conversation cards right now. One of the things I learned through my investigations is that you have a clause in your contract and you don't have to confirm what I'm not going to ask you to but what I what I discovered is that you have a clause in your contract which allows you to leave for I was I found out 60 million and you chose not to leave Manchester United you got a very very very large financial offer I mean I've seen some other numbers that are reported up to 200 million to leave Manchester United and you chose not to leave. You could have wrote off into the sunset you frankly I think the way you were playing you could have gone to almost any club in the world you could have got paid more and probably would have had a more certain guarantee of winning silverware and for some reason you chose to stay when that offer came in reportedly from the Middle East that you know the big offer that we're hearing for a contract that was worth a reportedly 200 million why didn't you go. I said it before I haven't fulfilled my dreams here you know at this club was that conversation you had with your wife yeah also what was that conversation she seems to be there all the time when you make these big decisions of course she's the one probably I never make a decision by myself because obviously moving around nowadays with two kids as a lot to say obviously and more than I don't know become a most richest person in my own town I want to leave my dreams and pass through the values to my kids that they they need to have and my family is always going to be the number one priority in everything I do because they followed my dream they they my wife obviously I know on the other side it looks great life obviously a lot of money good a lot of good things but she chose to leave my dream with me and that says a lot about her because let's say that when she chose to do that I was 17 years old going to a club with one point like let's say or you say 1500 you say 1500 yes a month in Italy a lot of uncertainty let's say she had her own life she had her own dreams and obviously she she said like I'm I'm going to help you and that what she did science science day world until now so she always as a say on everything I do and you've been with her since she was 16 you're 16 she was 16 I was about to be 17 so more or less and and then after that we have we have constructed a beautiful family two beautiful kids yeah and so on that day when you get you get a big offer to leave Manchester United of course as always I spoke obviously first my agent because he speaks with me about the offer but then the first thing I did was color and I was in I think was on there we were like we went on the postseason tour and the timing was not the best to talk with her because of time difference and everything but she was there again and what the worst she said was like have you have you achieved everything you wanted to achieve in your career and this is this the next step you want to give for for your future and for your career like because obviously this is the league I want to be this is the best league in the world this is where I'm going to enjoy my football as I'm not going to try and any other place so we we still have for dreams to fulfill why does I make you emotional I don't know talking about family it's it's tough just because in the in the football career you go through a lot ups and downs and a lot of difficult moments and let's say the ones that suffered most at them because they see your good moments your bad moments your good things your bad things your good side your bad side also but they always stand by you so that's the most important thing you can have in life and she's always been there she looks like my fiance a little bit she puts you in she puts his cause very down to earth I hear yeah she's she's the one that pushed me down to earth also when I'm probably getting too much or feeling too big she's always also very very tough on me to make me understand that's all these things to improve it's my let's say she's the second version of my dad probably that's why I chose her and she chose me in certain way does she know this does she know have you been able to tell her yeah yeah I'm a she's not she's gonna I can't say the word she's gonna say after she sees this and she's me crying she's gonna say I'm very soft I won't say the word exactly let's say I'm the affection one you know the one that likes hugs that likes she's she's more I don't know she's she likes she's she I think she she's through her life she had she had many things going on and she built this thing around her that she doesn't need let's say she doesn't need much love whatsoever but is there many moments where I know she needs I know she feels it I know she kind of like she's just like it's not good at saying what she feels and I'm more open I I show more my emotions I show more if I care if I don't care if I suffer if I don't suffer she she kind of closes a little bit for herself but she's a very strong woman to be honest I know you have two beautiful kids together yeah she we have a beautiful girl there was the first one at the time we were in Italy and then it came little Gonzalo when we were in England so one let's say that she's always saying that she's all Italian and one that basically looks like British is white blonde and one half English let's say and then two full Portuguese people I didn't realize your celebration were you you cover your ears is for your daughter yeah she covers her ears right yeah she used to do it when she was younger she's too old for that now she's a little very very very strong minded very strong attitude she has a lot from me in the terms of being very strong and very she's like she can take care of herself very well is exactly like her mom well I wanted to say thank you I'm a man United fan and hearing that you you know have gone through this very tumultuous period with the club where you could have gone where you've had many offers for many people to go and do something else and you've got people offered you even more money and for whatever reason I think it I now understand because I've understood your values that your parents instilled in you you chose to stay and to stick with us as a club and as a fan base so on behalf of myself in all of my friends at my management at fan base I just wanted to say a huge thank you loyalty is increasingly rare these days in football because people are often thinking about other things so as a man United fan thank you so much by doing that you've also taught me something as a man you've also taught me what loyalty is and how you treat other people and you've taught me a lesson about responsibly in my businesses in my relationships and in my life and I think this is a really important lesson because there are so many young men that look up to you and what you've said through the good and the bad times is that you keep on going you keep on going you keep on fighting you don't give up you don't quit and it's so great that the captain of the biggest club on earth has those values and puts those values before other things that might tempt someone with less integrity so I just wanted to say a huge thank you and I also am passing that on from many of your teammates who are very very very glad that you stayed. Thank you very much I really appreciate that it's very kind of was from here and I hope you stay even longer because I think we're coming into an interesting period of matches tonight where I think we have a lot of the sort of foundations in place now to carry on. That's what I hope so and I think there's not the club but everything in general the fans and everyone I think really really this have to be back to the glory days. Things have changed I mean any also here now I know the I know quite a lot of the guys at any of us I was away in the in the tour with a couple of them during the American preseason tour and one of the things they said to me is that when they arrived in the club there wasn't structure couple of them had said to me there just wasn't and it's so rare that you have this this huge gap between the manager and the ownership or the players in the ownership that usually in clubs there's structure they they've I think from what I've had from players they've put that structure in place now how is it changed with any us is the rival no I think was first of all was important because as you said not that we didn't have a structure but was very difficult for place to understand where where they had to go to talk in certain situations that they we were not very clear we should talk with and now I think is very clear that you have Jason that then you have Omar and then you have Sir Jim I'm I'm very aware that now the structure that we have is is a good foundation and a good base for us to understand where and what places we need to go if we need something as a club or as a players has improved we started a process with Ruben where we thought that would be a process of three four years that was the plan of the club then we know there was a break in a relationship there between the manager and the club and they had to change unfortunately and now they today they have announced that they want to go in the direction with with Michael and hopefully for me I hope that is they stable because the main thing the club needs is stability in terms of managing because if you really believe that Michael is the guy and and you took him to the job I think you have to give him the foundations you need to build what he thinks he needs for a successful team at the same time I think you brought someone in that knows what are the values of the club and I think that's the main thing and the most important thing that the club brings people in that know the values and know what's needed and have a great character to be at this club. Am I close the guy? Yeah because as I said I think is the is the one that knows the club better than any any player that here is being probably more time at the club I've been with him as a manager system manager and then manager the way he behaves it shows that he has the character to be the manager of many United and think that's very important to have someone that in the full process will know always where you want to go where you want to be and how much you want this club to succeed. You said it to me earlier that since Michael Caracas joined many United have won more points than any club in the Premier League and that's statistically accurate for this to continue on and to continue going forward obviously the summer is going to be really really important and I was talking to a few of the other players about this as well like Diego what needs to happen this summer in your opinion for Manchester United to continue to move up and potentially even fight for the title. We need recruitment this is obviously we know we know like obviously we're losing Casimiro there is a purple purple thing that we had so we're going to need a player to replace him. Either is a player that is already in the house either is a player that's coming we need to reinforce the team to become stronger as a team not we need the best player in the world this or that. No we need players that want to come to United to understand that we through a process that we want to win the league but it might not happen but this is the way we want to go to become the successful club that we were before. So I think the recruitment has to be the right one we need to bring the right people in again as we did last summer I think in that Ruben was great in the choices he made to bring the players he did to the club because he brought good characters good players and good professionals also and I think that's very important for the next one. Bruno we have a closing tradition on this podcast where the last guest leaves a question for the next guest not knowing who they're leaving the question for and the question that's been left for you is if we sat here in five years time and the five years that had just passed were a huge success what would have happened to have happened? Huge success let's say that I've won the Premier League I've won the Champions League with the club and we've brought the club back to the place he has to be in terms of the club obviously in five years time I would like to be able to that's one of the gold ones to do with my national team of course let's say that's my biggest goal in terms of career the World Cup I would say because winning the Premier League and the Champions League with this club will be amazing but representing my nation will be always the biggest achievement I have in my career because now many players get to do that you know like representing your this is when you represent your people when you represent your parents, your brother, sister, wife, kids this is you represent that small nation inside but inside but big in quality and big in love and fearless country that has conquered the world many times in different ways and do it in a football way will be a great achievement for us irrespective of what happens here and I very much believe that Manchester United has now the potential to go and challenge for these trophies here because of all the hard work that has been put in by many people in this club but also because of your loyalty and irrespective of what happens you're going to be a cult here at this club forever not irrespective of this stuff because I think you've done something which is even harder and even more rare in the modern world which is you've shown tremendous loyalty, unbelievable character you've shown humanity and you've set an example for the club when we were at our weakest when we needed someone to do that the most it's all well and good doing it when everything's great it's all well and good but doing being that committed in that loyal and setting that much of an example and continuing to run on the pitch but also to be an exceptional human off the pitch when times are hard I think says even more about a man so again on behalf of all the United fans a huge huge thank you and please sign the contract when he's in the table Bruno thank you thank you very much thank you so much you